Whatās up with Youtuberās dropping a link to their spicy take and then never joining the conversation?
11 Likes
As a much smaller presence all I can say is that itās hard to balance all the factors that go into producing any content and trying to make a living off of it.
I cannot speak to the intent of the post here, but I get that it feels like a marketing play to drum up traffic instead of having a conversation. My guess though, is with the video having 393 comments at the time of this message that the conversation was moved to/happened on the video.
I can understand the feeling it leaves, but I can also imagine Liam is trying to juggle making videos, engaging with the community, drumming up traffic, plus a boat load of other things that are behind the scenes. As individuals it is up to us whether or not we engage with these posts, or how/where we understand the conversation is taking place.
But what do I know 
1 Like
you know a whole lot my dude, its nearly a shame that you may feel included in the Youtuber umbrella because at this point you are a straight up educator my man.
if Liam didnt have a handful of empty threads on here with just his video in the first post i wouldnt find it so tacky. thats about as useful and community minded as a bot.
and i get that this is apart of the game but gatekeeping outside challenges to his opinions behind engagement boosting his own video isnt exactly a noble reason to ignore the conversations he started in other communities.
and to keep it on topic: TE has a vision and they execute it and they dont care about the input of people they dont know or work with. thats hard, thats artistic, thats what we /should/ want from people charging an arm and a leg for their designs. but tbh i dont even fit myself in this category of people any more, TE prices make sense based on pure design and connection to their audience. i see it like buying from an artists booth at the farmerās market. its more expensive, its kinda niche, but you have a closer connection to the people who made it because of a shared perspective. QC is of course frustrating as Iām sure it is endlessly frustrating for them as well. but as long as they can replace the item, seems that works well enough, considering the size of their whole shindig.
i like that they got their own manufacturing factory for the ep line. i think this is their solution to their QC problems going forward. i think once they have more experience running their own lines they shouldnt run into so many QC problems. and if they do keep running into them, its easier to have informed and directed frustration considering they control the kitchen. after listening to that recent interview with Jesper, it sounds like they prioritize doing things themselves and learning how to do new things. thats awesome and of course it comes with hiccups in the learning process. i understand why some people wouldnt want to give them their money because of that, but hey, im the kind of person who will never use kickstarter or preorder something so different strokes.
2 Likes
We can all be honestā¦ the whole synthfluencer phenomenon sucksā¦ I started my own silly channel because I couldnāt believe how much people were talking up the next neat thing only to give up on it in a week or two. True mastery takes time and effort, but that isnāt exciting.
People reach out to me to ask if Iāve watched person x or yā¦ and all I can say is ānope, I hardly pay attention anymoreā because I find a lot of the content quite vapid. I try not to create too much āhypeā myself, and would much rather help educate people. Maybe it isnāt as exciting, but it feels like honest work. Besides, my personal intent hasnāt been to turn this into a job and I donāt feel the need to drive my ego based on views. The moment it stops being fun or interesting Iāll go do something else, but so far the small community Iāve created continues to ask interesting questions, challenge me with problems to solve, and I am just happy to give back to people without needing much of anything in return.
I do find it a head scratcher to flog on TE for doing weird āout thereā stuff, because frequently the same people are nit picking how product y doesnāt have function x. Sure, everything evolves into a crab eventually I guessā¦ but is that what we all really want? Iād prefer the company willing to do strange boutique stuff and see what sticks, than the company that follows the same tired design. I fully accept that 99.999% of the stuff out there isnāt for me, and Iām okay with that. Anything else I say will just sound like grumpy old man āget off my lawnā ramblingā¦
As far as the QC goes, itās easy to be upset when it effects and impacts yourself, but we donāt really know what sales numbers look like, and you mostly just hear people complaining about how terrible things are, and rarely how great of an experience theyāve had. Like many many things in life, most music gear is doing its thing when you hardly have to think about it, but when it implodes everybody has an opinion. I am bummed personally about having had to send the OP-1 Field out for repair two times, but these things happen, and I got a launch OP-1 Field so it was certainly more likely to hit strange growing pain issues.
I hadnāt known about pulling more in house, but it sounds like a good idea. It definitely helps a company iterate over manufacturing decisions faster, but typically at an increase in cost to the consumer. Iāll have to look into this more, because it does sound interesting in the long run for TE.
So I guess as an opinion piece the video was fine, I got about halfway through it and moved on. Iām just fascinated that so many people want opinion pieces like that, but I guess they arenāt comfortable enough to state a personal opinion? Heck, for the amount of gear I have turned over I could make a full time channel talking about what Iāve sold off and parted ways with, but it just seems silly. Iāve done a few because people ask and are curious, but I guess for me I value the experience and knowledge, not the opinions.
2 Likes
for real! i was thinking about it and if youtube is to TV, then lots of synthfluencer content is basically MTVās Cribs and your videos are like classic discovery channel or This Old House, well thought out, intelligent and intentional and generally educational
We donāt need to talk about TE we should talk about synthfluencers and youtubers stoking the minds of impressionable buyers then shifting blame. The video is predictably biased and based on flimsy logic.
Anybody who thought rabbit AI was gonna improve their life deserved to get scammed. Unless TE were involved in product dev beyond the industrial design, nothing about their ties to rabbit are concerning. To be clear, there are actually valid critiques that could be lobbed at TE and their business practices but personally I donāt see this or any design project for another business as anything but fulfilling a contract.
Anybody who bought this AI tool or playdate simply because TE designed it (without doing enough research to determine whether they actually need the thing) is an idiot. I feel no sympathy for em because they can easily find another idiot whoāll buy it off them secondhand since weāre all just brainwashed TE zombies.
I donāt think its a TE doesnāt care what others think ā¦ IMO they design things to their own preferenceā¦
The TX mixer and the whole field lineup is quite impressive as a portable studio package and thatās what you are paying for,>> design of function and practicality.
I honestly feel like the OPZ and PO KO2 could be future proof / sell for a decade plus, if it wasnāt for QC on the hardware sideā¦
That being said OP-Z II is one of the most anticipated workstation releases of '24-'25š ā¦
Looking more forward to it than the Machine III wich is just around the corner/even though its a complete DAW ecosystemā¦ why? The design/flow and quality code/sequencing features in that UI
ā¦ people wait two years for Cirklons wich although massive in a studio setting is pales in flow /work speed, probability and fun factor! 
Same can be said about the zero boot up time of the KO 2, its these priorities that makes me believe in TE as a design team and quality craftsmen. The UI the fictions and the soundā¦ IMO the PO 12 in a bigger XOX format could easily compete against the heavy weights of drum machines ā¦it just sound that good/punchy
What worries me is that they cut some obvious ādonātā corners ā¦ like not spending the extra cents on endless encoders on the KO2 
ā¦ or not upgrading to a better build body on the OPZ as soon as problems started emergingā¦ just a simple Z V2 to keep sales goingā¦ IMO the Z sales could have been sustainable for many years that way alongside new synth/drum/sampling engineās in firmware upgrades
So a few mist opportunities if you ask my console ā¦ but otherwise TE make companies with decades of inventory look like cheapskates and amateurs when comparing concept, sound and UI ā¦ its like they take pride in function vs others that might be more market driven, leaving out design choices or feature due to marketing zones , overlapping sales ā¦ wich is so CEO datedā¦
TE is like where the artist make the productās rather than the cheer holdings
2 Likes
i think i was pretty much saying the same thing but a little more tersely heh. Jesper was talking about how he hates the idea of ādesigned by a crowdā where everyones input must be implemented, i totally agree when it comes to creative projects/products like they make at TE. if they listened to what everyone online had to say their products needed, they would be bloated, boring, and indistinguishable from the rest. thats why i think its cool that they ādont care what people thinkā
Op-Z II?? 
I mean itās always good to be hopeful with TE
1 Like
Donāt know why itās funny? Its been mentioned that Z2 is in the works (this is coming from TE and you can find info on this here in the forums
ā¦ I would also expect evolved POs Aka just from the logicās of building āon our foundation/investments/code and user baseā ā¦
Aswell the sales success of the KO2ā¦ I donāt file this as hope as much as progression of inventory investments
Itās funny because Iām the person who confirmed the timeframe - search on the forum and youāll find the post,
and itās also funny because TE likes to screw with their customers, as seen with the Z - everyone thinks a field or version 2 is coming - but why? Despite it being their second best product (not in quality ofc, possibly their worst) they have not and most likely will never confirm an op-z v2 aka the op-z field which is what you wanted to say, because they wonāt commit to making the field a better product than the disaster and failure that it is. Itās my favorite TE product but I KNOW after 5 units breaking on some level that itās a broken design that needs total rebuild and retooling (very expensive); itās not gonna be āhey you know those awesome working parts in our plastic POS Z models that keep getting returned? Letās just put it in aluminum chassis and weāll be good ,then slap a field on there, - charge $1000 and call it a successā
As I said itās nice to dream of op-z field (the field line is finished, according to the same sources) but I think the little toy car followed by the KO II a few days later was definitely a signal there is a lot more teenage spirit in their business and marketing mechanics so I would rather have adult expectations
Plus I personally wonāt buy another TE product Willynilly ever again, not off of hype, marketing or ads because they can roll out in mass quantities of bad batches. From now on, if I ever bought anything new from them again, I would wait 6 months + to see all the recalls and fadergates fixed before investing any good money on anything with op-z in the name ā¦who knows maybe itāll be the EP-Z???
(But op-z v2 lol, the entire idea is a joke to me, and the only reason I bought a [soon to be 6th] op-z when I get my warranty RMA, is because it was practically and literally free <got lucky 5th time in that way>ā¦Iām also the current record holder for most op-z trials and returns according to a few guys here)
No one knows for sure, but Iām sure Iām closer to a good guess than people just thinking āI heard it was confirmed for sureā (yeah , I was one of the guys to reconfirm the confirmation so whooops) because of the business side, not the TE fan in me who hopes and wants for one
Itās not funny they sell the op-z in its current state (for 6 years at that)ā¦I mean would you really want to give money back to someone for a product you owned 5 times knowing full well it will break again surely at some point ? Just because there is a āfieldā or āv1.5ā label on it? A piece of shit wrapped in a beautiful box, with ornamental wrapping, beautiful string and bows and ribbons, is still just a nicely boxed piece of shit in the endā¦donāt let packaging fool you, and TE is very very good at fooling people(both in a good way but also disappointing way)
(And they didnāt even care about superboorh this year, which is now only months away from the āsurprise release 2025ā release of the z field, itās mid 2024, and all I can see on the horizon is pushing cheap, lower end products while keeping the field line static.)
So you heard it here and you heard it here from me first , I predict like most realistics, there will not be another iteration of the operator-z; but I have a strong suspicion the EP-Z will be what it turns into
My guess is as good as yours, but yeah, sorry but if you want to find the confirmation of early 2025 , youāre looking at it LOL (and no way in hell is it coming out in the next few months) , but just bein honest with you
The op-z messed with my head for almost a year straight and now thatās enough , I would not buy another op-z for build quality improvement either because itās so awesome and perfect but when you own the op-1 alongside, it becomes kind of clear why the op-z is priced at 1/4 of what the op1 isā¦.
Anyway, the op-z as it is is good enough for me now , so I get a double trigger if I press too lightly, so what? Itās sequencer, just go back and fix it ā¦and if itās almost impossible just hook up an Arturia Minilab 3 and play it with a controllerā¦.
But days of refreshing news feeds to see when the new op-z is coming out are far behind me and I just started with TE like months ago lol thatās why this is humorous , no one knows anything but itās as ridiculous as buying a brand new op-z today
i dont think its that serious, they make what they make, dont take things too seriously, and then people get incredibly invested on a weird almost stockholm (ha) syndrome level. thats on the consumer and their poisonous consumer habits, not TE.
Didnāt mean it serious, I mean: They do like to toy with their customers - as seen with the toy car and Ko II timing - as I explained
oh, that was like a whole paragraph and a half later and in totally different context talking about the next op-z so i missed that connection
1 Like
allot of assumptions there mate, from predicting a mk2 module that you now sate is bogus and funny as others reference set post, that a new body for the Z would need expensive re-engineering, me referring to a field model, or TE screwing with customer and never releasing Z 2 modelā¦
I donāt know where to start ā¦ I donāt think Im even going to engageā¦ Id be completely ecstatic for more tactical EP Z format (Wich I would view as a Z 2) ā¦
To stand the test of time it will though have to have significantly better/deeper synthesis capabilities including drums and improved sound (current standard are higher today both in digital and hybrid, also more imidiacy to sampling /chopping and an extended āspeakā vocal synthesis 
would be much loved
That being said Id like to say that āOP speakā is probably the all time greatest mini groovebox ever and am just as thrilled to see that evolve into an EP format.
1 Like
The op-z will remain my fave TE product ! (If that wasnāt clear ; I will have a 6th one or a field within the timeframe)
And I would also get an ep-z
(Also if you want me to find the prediction of the op-z early 2025 Iāll find it for you)
1 Like
What can I say, Iām passionate about the op-z. Almost devoted to it. My bad if I threw anyone off
Sometimes weāre only as cool as our last post.
1 Like
Respect
Your pretty cool yourself man, I dig what you said, and I agree with a lot of your premises, especialy that of the dedication involved in mastery versus momentary fixation only to move onto the next item and never reach even intermediate levels of proficiency -( if Iām not mistaken youāre a legend in your own right ?)
The only thing that might make me qualify as any kind of legend honestly is a broad interest in providing as much information as I can for free, being tenacious at problem solving, a willingness to think outside the box, and have a strong dislike for seeing very low value content to describe how things āworksā being charge for ludicrous prices. Donāt get me wrong, weāve all got to eat, but some of the work out there is incredibly lazy and barely above just reading from the manual.
Beyond thatā¦ Iāve written a guide for the SP404 mk2 as an attempt answer the āwhyāsā and āhowāsā about the device that arenāt really obvious from the manual. A few months ago I put out a quick reference for it to try and capture all the shortcuts and other critical information that I have a hard time completely memorizingā¦ then had to rapidly rush to update from firmware 3.x to 4.04 because of my poor timing to release. Plus Iāve published around 760+ 5 minute (or so) videos just on the SP404 mk2. Probably another 70āish on the MPCā¦ a handful on the OP-1, and then a smattering of other random instruments and effects.
Seriously though, by not charging for the majority of what Iām doing, it is also a huge relief. The guide alone, given away for free, sometimes feels like a burden to keep updating with every firmware release, and I can only imagine how much more pressure Iād feel if I was charging for it, or charging for āfuture updatesā. Instead Iām happy to put it out there for what it is, let people judge it, and if they donāt like it, they are more than welcome to move on.
My philosophy is that anybody can make art, be it music, paintings, poetry, or whateverā¦ and the videos have really tried to be āif I can do this in 5 minutes, then so can youā. So I donāt usually get into super deep technical details, but I do try and show cool things off, do weird experiments, and get people thinking.
Also I donāt have any licensing deals, I donāt get free gear, and I donāt plan on making this my full time job. As a result, I havenāt bothered doing much marketing of what Iām doing beyond forum posts, and I guess word of mouth and good will have gotten me a small and friendly community, but honestly Iām just happy to help educate folks and giving back what and where I can. Thereās enough garbage in the world, and honestly Iām trying not to create more pollution. What Iām doing isnāt to everybodyās taste either, and honestly Iām okay with that.
I had thought to do some similar work for the OP-Z, as I also love the goofy little device, but I think as I get settled into the next project it will probably be the DirtyWave M8. Iāve been using it off and on for about a year and a half now, and I have been having a blast getting back into pseudo programming to get interesting sounds, effects, and patterns. The OP-Z (and OP-1F, heck even the SP404 mk2) pair really nicely with the M8ā¦ so weāll see where I go with my time.
Everyone out there have a great one, and see you on the flip side!
5 Likes